Ep 24 - Looking in Layers with Ian Fennelly
In this episode, I speak with Ian Fennelly, an artist and urban sketcher in the UK. Ian paints his urban environments in vivid, rich, and sometimes fantastical color-scapes. His lines and colors cleverly contrast the tussle between representing objective reality and subjective emotions. As Ian likes to point out, he is not recreating a scene, but creating art from a scene. The title of this episode is based on the title of his latest book and is an apt description of his artistic process. His paintings are the result of looking and looking again, patiently building layer upon layer of observation, emotion, and artistic judgment.
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Transcript
03:14 They begin by speaking about the 'new normal', and the surreality of connecting with people - friends as well as strangers - on Zoom and IG Live sessions. Ian talks about the privilege of being able to do online workshops in the absence of real-life workshop programs.
"I'm just trying to make people feel as good about creativity as I possibly can... and to be able to do that is a really cool things, it's good for me, it's good for them, it's good for everybody."
They talk about how, incidentally, it is the best kind of time to be isolated from everyone. How even 10 years ago the experience of lockdown and isolation would have been entirely different.
15:26 Nishant asks how Ian has handled the pivot to the "new normal" since the pandemic began.
Ian talks about being grateful for the work he does, and the joy he derives from it. This keeps him from not becoming morose or losing motivation even though he isn't able to go outside for sketches or workshops.
They talk about the impossibility of making concrete plans for even 2-3 months ahead of the present, because of the enormous uncertainties of these times. Ian mentions the number of workshops he has had to cancel, and the precarious teaching plans he has for the rest of 2021.
24:56 As they reach the subject of motivation, Nishant asks Ian how he became an artist, and from what kind of motivations.
Ian talks about how early peer-motivation and encouragement motivated him to make more art.
"All children enjoy encouragement and praise. And it never really stopped for me."
Ian mentions the first time he drew from observation outdoors.
"It made me realize that you see so much more. And it also made me realize you don't have to draw everything you see. From a photograph you don't get that."
"Painting is a way for me to orient myself in that place." - Ian, on how drawing on location helps him better understand a place.
Nishant comments on the various ways our interaction with the 3-dimensional space manifests when we are on location. But this experience is limited when we draw out of a photograph. They talk about how photographs dictate reality to us, but being on location gives us the freedom to make changes to our scene and tweak the composition in little ways.
Ian raises the point that his unique style also emerges from being an on-location artist - the tweaking of perspective and the wonkiness of the lines.
38:30 Nishant cycles back to Ian's past. Asks what was Ian's idea for himself as an artist when he was in university.
Ian explains how he became the artist he is today over time. Explains his influences and learning from Wimbledon College in London, then doing art on the side while he was a primary school teacher, until the time he decided to be a full-time artist.
Ian's teaching background as a primary school teacher enabled him to break down his art concepts and become a USk-instructor more easily.
44:00 Nishant asks in what ways Urban Sketching workshops and primary school teaching are exactly the same thing?
Ian talks about the importance of communicating the big picture and learning objectives, and the value of positive feedback.
Nishant asks Ian about how he understands the "business" of being an artist
"All the work I was doing was in oil paints, but I was finding that it was taking me too long. So I had a lightbulb moment, that I need to change this process, to speed this up. So I started working in watercolor."
"These were the three strands - all the commercial painting I did, there was me drawing on holiday, and there was me training teachers. And in 2014, they all came together. Those three strands connected - drawing, painting, teaching - and the best way to express that was through urban sketching workshops."
Ian talks about how the conversation around art changed for him once he got involved with urban-sketchers. They share what they enjoy most about sketching with other people.
64:25 Nishant asks about Ian's drawing process, and how he puts layers upon layers with lines, and both wet and dry colors. What is the objective representation? Which part is more subjective? What represents the scene? Which bits tell us more about Ian himself?
Referring to Ian's linework, Nishant explains accuracy vs precision. Accuracy is how correct you are, and precision is how consistent you are.
"There is a part of me that is always trying to be accurate - the mechanical engineer - but the artist in me trying to tell him that you don't have to be exactly correct, you just have to make sense within this world you're trying to create on this page." - Nishant, on the balance between accuracy and precision in his mind.
"If I want to draw a straight line, I can draw a straight line as well as anybody. But I choose often not to. Because I think a straight line is what it is, but sometimes a line has a life of its own as well."
"I miss things out and put extra things in, and distort stuff, and miss out windows, and be a little subversive, I suppose. Because I feel like I can get away with it. I want to try and get away with it, I want to push it as much as I can."
They talk about the importance of pushing beyond your comfort zone, and how they make artistic choices of where to put more or less details.
"If I'm at the edge of what I'm comfortable doing, that's when the good stuff happens. And a large part of that involves having faith that some kind of magic will show up. If I just try something that's a little challenging, something will work." - Nishant.
Nishant talks about the importance and uniqueness of artists drawing with long lines.
"Your line is your signature."
90:47 Break
93:10 What is it like to come back to a drawing after taking a break, and what is it like to stretch the act to 2hr or 2h30min? Is there something more you find this way?
Ian says that the length of the drawing is a function of the scene's complexity, and the stories he wants to tell through his art.
"When I go somewhere, I want to say as much about the place as I can."
Nishant asks if the time factor means that Ian also spends a lot of time deciding where to sketch from. Ian explains his process before going to a new city, and when exploring a new place. Also how he negotiates obstacles like cars and crowds when they suddenly appear in his scene.
They talk about framing within a sketchbook or page, and how it affects the world we see.
Nishant mentions how Ian's sketches don't belong anywhere specifically in time, even though they have a strong sense of space. Is this an intentional decision and what does it mean for Ian's art?
Ian talks about the constraints he imposes upon his own work, in terms of stylistic decisions as well as limitatons for things he does not consider himself good at.
Nishant asks what it means for Ian's drawings that they don't include people.
"What I draw is a record of me looking at something, over the period of 3 hours."
Nishant offers how he thinks about drawing crowds of people.
Nishant asks about Ian's book, Layers of Looking. They discuss what it means to write a book with a non-artist reader in mind.
Ian talks about the places he is more eager to visit, including places he will see for the purpose of giving workshops. They talk about how sketching makes travel more wonderful, and renders even ordinary things into beautiful sights.
